How to Start a Podcast

Cheryl Hodgson [0:04]

Hi, everyone, I'm Cheryl Hodgson. Welcome to the Brandaide podcast. Today I welcome Steve Olsher. Steve Olsher is the founder of Podcast Magazine, the New Media Summit and has a 30-year history as an entrepreneur. He founded Liquor.com, he's published best-selling books on the New York Times, and we will talk about a lot of those things. He is known as one of the world's most foremost reinvention experts. And one of his podcasts is Reinvention Radio. Famous for helping individuals and corporations become exceptionally clear on their "What?" That is, the one thing they were created to do. His practical, no-holds-barred approach to life and business propels his clients towards achieving massive profitability, while also cultivating life of purpose, conviction and contribution. Welcome, Steve Olsher!

Steve Olsher [1:05]

Thank you. Do we have any time left for anything now, right?

Cheryl Hodgson [1:10]

Well, you've had a fabulous career.

Steve Olsher [1:13]

Yeah. Thank you for that.

Cheryl Hodgson [1:14]

Well, and also, I'd like to add, you're one of my current mentors, and I'm very grateful for everything that I've been learning. So...

Steve Olsher [1:22]

Yeah, I'm glad that you are part of our Icon Maker Program.

Cheryl Hodgson [1:25]

Yes, that's a whole nother program I forgot to mention, there's more! Yeah, so. So Steve, tell me about this Podcast Magazine you're launching.

Steve Hodgson [1:35]

Well, you know, that's, that's a pretty big undertaking. You know, we don't have enough going on, let's just launch a magazine. You know, why not, right? How hard could that be?

Cheryl Hodgson [1:49]

No problem at all.

Steve Olsher [1:50]

No problem, no problem at all. So, yeah, there's, it's going great. It's really, really, really going great. So much so that we're actually being overwhelmed right now with inbound around it. So I know that the interest is there. Just to clarify, so, what we're launching is Podcast Magazine, which is really dedicated towards covering podcasts, podcast culture and the podcasters that fans love so it's, it's really dedicated towards the fans. It's not an industry publication, so to speak, it's almost like Sports Illustrated or People Magazine, so to speak, for the world of podcasting. And, based on initial response, as of this recording, perhaps when this releases, it will already be out there, but as of this recording, we're only sitting at about 100 days from... the inception of the concept to getting this thing launched. So it'll be about 115 days total from concept to launch. And we've already got over 10,000 people subscribed to the magazine. And we haven't even launched yet. So really, really, really going well.

Cheryl Hodgson [3:06]

Well, we're going to back up on the genesis of all of this. We started with where you are now. But I'd like to just point out that I love this topic in terms of my audience and Brandaide because I am obsessed with the concept of brands being about from Revolution to Evolution. And you're on the wave of that with the Podcast Magazine. And I'd like to go a little deeper on that, because you've been in podcasting for a while and you started the New Media Summit several years ago. Maybe you could share with the audience a little bit more about the New Media Summit, and how that led you to evolve to the podcast. It's all tied together, right?

Steve Hodgson [3:56]

You know, it may not look like that on the surface, but clearly it is if somebody took an outside perspective and really just looked at it. Let me just say this, which is, I've been podcasting off and on actually since 2009, when we launched our first episode of Reinvention Radio, and then really on a consistent basis since 2015. With both Reinvention Radio and Beyond 8 Figures. So I've always been a huge fan and proponent of the space. And it occurred to me a couple of years ago, about two and a half years ago, that we, like most podcasters, have trouble finding really great guests for our shows. I mean, people can look really good on paper, but then you get them on the show and they're not the best guests, right? And so as I was beginning to talk to the other podcasters over the years, I was finding that they were having similar troubles. And then knowing how many inbound requests we were getting to be a guest on our show, and then our shows, it was overwhelming., There were a lot more people who wanted to be on our shows than we had room for, because we only do one episode a week. And that was very much the same problem that a lot of my podcaster friends were having. They were being inundated with requests. So there was this supply-demand issue, right? Where you have a lot of people who want to be guests on shows, and you have a lot of people who have great shows, but have to be very selective about the guests that they feature. And so that's really where the idea for the New Media Summit was born, which is, "what if we did an event where we brought in top podcasters, and we gave a fairly small group, let's say 150 attendees, the opportunity to meet them, and pitch them on who they are and what they do, and literally get booked on the spot?" And I started talking to podcasters, they were like, "yeah, that sounds like a great event, I'll come to that." Then, I started putting it out to the public to see if they would pay that to come to that event, to be able to pitch. And our first New Media Summit happened in September of 2017. And in March 2020 we'll actually do our sixth event. So yeah, I've been involved in the podcast industry for a while, both as a podcaster, as an event host, and now with the magazine as well.

Cheryl Hodgson [6:32]

I really appreciate your sharing that because, from my own perspective as a consumer, and a fairly new podcaster, I took your training course, the online course. And I think probably one of the things that grabbed me the most significantly, is, I know people buy with emotion, but it was the statistic you gave and shared about how podcasting is starting to grow at an exponential rate. And it's becoming rapidly ubiquitous in our culture. As something people... So I think that's a factor in how, well, hopefully for the success of the magazine as well.

Steve Olsher [7:19]

Yeah, very much in its embryonic stages still, in terms of the industry itself. And when you come right down to it, there are... The last set of statistics shows about 800 thousand podcasts right now that are published. Let's just say approximately a quarter of those actually still release new episodes on a consistent basis. So even if it's 250,000, which I think is a fairly aggressive number in terms of the shows that release new episodes on a consistent basis, you still have billions of websites. Billions of blogs. Hundreds and hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of thousands of radio stations. I mean, if you look at, just from a sheer data perspective, in terms of the number of available podcasts, versus the number of available newspapers, or available radio stations, websites, etc., it still very much pales in comparison. And so what you're starting to see is really that demand for accessing and consuming podcast is finally, a little bit more in line with the technology that is available to access the shows. Because it's a fairly new phenomenon that you could push a button on a phone and access a podcast. It's a fairly new phenomenon that you could push a button on a dashboard of your car...

Cheryl Hodgson [8:58]

Oh, CarPlay is phenomenal!

Steve Olsher [9:00]

CarPlay, right, and access podcasts. And so what used it to be was a whole set of steps that you'd have to follow if you wanted to listen to a podcast. And needless to say, if you weren't fully committed to that process of doing step one, step two, step three, step four, you weren't going to listen to shows. And so now the technology has finally caught up to demand, you're going to see, not only will the number of shows dramatically increase, but the number of people listening to podcasts on a daily basis is exponentially growing. And the data already supports that.

Cheryl Hodgson [9:43]

Well, and I think it ties into the world of brands and branding because, one of the challenges for any entrepreneur or business owner, whether in services, particularly in services, to some extent in products, well clearly in products, but it's a different type of challenge, which is, there are so many platforms, and so many channels to be seen and heard on. And so how have you found, since you have had a number of years of working with podcasts now, how have you found that podcasting as a platform has allowed you to grow your brand?

Steve Olsher [10:20]

Yeah. So, I think there's two questions there. And let me just address those. And...

Cheryl Hodgson [10:25]

Oh, there could be four, I don't know!

Steve Olsher [10:28]

Let me address those in separate ways. First and foremost, just in terms of literal platforms, as far as podcasting is concerned, let me just say that if you're going to ride a couple of horses, ride Apple Podcasts, and ride Spotify. Period, end story. Those are the platforms to focus on, forget about everything else. Now as far as branding, and the platform of podcasting, if that's what you meant, in terms of growing your brand and your business and so on, it's a really interesting game right now. From the standpoint of even though the industry itself is still very much in the embryonic stages, what you're seeing is that there are some dominant players. Meaning there are some dominant podcasts that are going to be very hard to dethrone. So what ends up happening is, even as new shows are being launched, discovering those new shows is really, really hard to do. And if you're a podcaster, having your show found is really, really hard to do. Because you have this, ascending spiral of popularity, so to speak, where popular shows, currently, shows that are popular, show up in the charts. And so they're there, and you go to Top Shows and there's your top shows, and on that you'll see these shows. And what happens is, as more people come to find out about podcasts, and they come on to those channels under those platforms, and they see those popular shows, they listen to those popular shows first, those shows then get more subscribers, more downloads, more ratings, more reviews. And it then moves them further up the chart. So it becomes like this ascending spiral. So for new shows, it's really, really hard to break into. So is it impossible? No! I mean, you can certainly do it. It's done all the time, but typically, when you have other platforms, in terms of like you have a big social following, or you have a big mailing list, or something of that nature, you could then build your audience. But as a, so what's the average mere mortal to do here, you know, should you make a podcast?

Cheryl Hodgson [12:42]

What is your advice to the mere mortals, like...?

Steve Olsher [12:46]

And the answer is, you absolutely should get into podcasting. It's absolutely the right thing to do in order to support your brand and to support your company. And be very, very focused in terms of a particular niche. Don't try to compete with the Joe Rogans and the Daily’s of the world and all those. Be really specific, like your show is a perfect example. A show that focuses specifically on branding and the work that you do, or trademarks and you know, all that stuff, right? So a perfect example of a great niche show. Because, I mean, let's face it, even if, I don't know, 50 people, download an episode about branding and trademarks and other work that you do, that's 50 people who are raising their hand to say, "I'm interested in that subject." There's no better way to establish yourself as the credible authority in this niche, than by having a show that focuses on your area of expertise. And there's no better way to generate highly targeted leads. And those leads, of course can turn into conversations, those conversations can turn into clients. So it's a really powerful medium from the standpoint of when someone is searching. just like SEO for websites, when someone is searching for a particular subject, and they find you, it just really elevates your positioning in the marketplace if you have a show on that particular subject.

Cheryl Hodgson [14:33]

Well, and I think there was something I heard you say once too, and it's just a little bit of an add-on to what you've just said, which impacted me quite a bit in my decision to launch my own show, which was the fact that it's truly, you said someone raises their hand, even if it's only 50 people who download the show. But 50 people who listen to you, who choose to take 30 to 45 minutes from their day to listen to your interview on a particular topic, say this, for example: someone who might be interested in podcasting, since you know, that's what we're discussing. That becomes an intimate conversation really, it's almost like a one on one. And that's, a beautiful way to put it.

Steve Olsher [15:20]

Yeah. And I also liken it to a speaking gig. Having your own podcast, or being a guest on podcasts is really the equivalent of having access to thousands and thousands and thousands of free stages. And would you take a speaking gig, if there were just 50 people in the audience, but all 50 of those people had already filled out a prequalification form to say, "I'm interested in learning more about branding and trademark, all that stuff." That speaking gig, all day long. And could you walk out of there with 30, 40, 50% of the room saying yes to a particular offer? I think that's entirely possible.

Cheryl Hodgson [16:18]

Wow, that's powerful. So, you have a second podcast, which is Beyond 8 Figures. I've listened to several of those episodes, and I think it's brilliant, by the way. And I really mean that. So, how is the audience different, and your approach in that particular, either the marketing or the podcast itself? Is it different?

Steve Olsher [16:45]

So Reinvention Radio is a very general show. And we have people who come on there, from all walks of life, who have done all sorts of things. And just some of the most amazing stories of people who have reinvented their lives, and are now doing something to really dismantle the status quo in another arena. It's the architect turned couple’s therapist. It's the graphic designer turned trademark attorney. I don't know, whatever.

Cheryl Hodgson [17:18]

People who start a restaurant in upstate Vermont, or their Airbnb or a bread and breakfast, right? Isn't that the...

Steve Olsher [17:26]

Yeah, a lot of those sort of folks for sure. And so, very general and if I was to advise someone on what to do now, in terms of if they were to launch a podcast, I would never say to them "launch a show like Reinvention Radio." It's too broad. I mean, I love the show. It's a great show. We always have amazing guests on. But we have a head start. So we've been doing this for a while, so we've already been able to build audience, and as I said, that discoverability is much harder when you're starting out now. And a general show is just really tough to make work. And so Beyond 8 Figures is really focused on helping those who are interested in business, or are in business, to start, scale, and/or exit from their business by bringing on entrepreneurs who have either exited for more than $10 million, or currently gross more than $10 million annually. And so we really get to the bottom of how they started and scaled it, and in some cases, exited from those businesses. And it gives me an opportunity to share some of my expertise, having been an entrepreneur for 30 plus years and chime in on the conversations and whatnot. But really, for me, it does two things. It's again, a credibility and authority builder. From the standpoint of, "Geez, how does this guy attract people who have created eight figure plus businesses?"

Cheryl Hodgson [19:00]

Well, how do you attract those people, Steve?

Steve Olsher [19:01]

It's a game, it's a lot of word of mouth, it's a lot of reaching out, it's a lot of seeing people being written up in publications and reaching out to them. And it's a lot of... just luck in a lot of circumstances. Somebody's launching a book, and they need a platform for their book. We're going to have Dean Graziosi on as an example this week. And so, Dean's built several eight figure plus businesses, and he's in the middle of a launch right now, and he needs more visibility. So it just really depends on what their currency is at the moment, and if you can help them fulfill that, you stand a pretty decent shot of getting them on. But the other side of the coin here is, there's something to be said for surrounding yourself with people who help you elevate your game. And that's both literally and figuratively, right? And so, number one, having people on who have businesses that grossed more than $10 million a year or have exited, are pretty rare breed of people, right?

Cheryl Hodgson [20:17]

Yes, they are!

Steve Olsher [20:18]

Yeah, very, very, very rare. And so what happens? So then I build my Rolodex, because now I've got access to people who I've served. And I've said, "Hey, let me help you. Let me get you some visibility." So now they're like, "cool, right? This guy helped me." So it builds the Rolodex. It gives me an opportunity to turn around at some point say, "Hey, you were a great guest on the show. I'm looking for XYZ. Is this something you can help with?" So building the Rolodex is a great byproduct of it. And then on top of that, it's also a matter of, when you think about who your audience is, if my audience aspires to build an eight figure plus business, and I bring on all of these experts, I now put myself at the hub of that wheel. Where all the spokes connect. And so now I've got all this data, all this information coming in. So when I turn around and I say to somebody, "hey, I can help you to build a 6, 7, 8-figure business, not only because it's within my wheelhouse, because it's something that I've done, but also because I have access to so much information, so many people and so much data”, and this, that and the other, that it then makes it a much more believable offer, in terms of people believing that they can say, "yeah, if I hire Steve, there are ways that he can help me." So everything starts with the offer, and we preach this till we're blue in the face in the Icon Maker program and that's part of what we're looking at, is if everything starts with the offer what's the easiest path to getting people to say yes to that?

Cheryl Hodgson [22:04]

Well, and there's a couple of things you shared there that I'd like to unpack a little bit more. One is something you said a minute ago about elevating your own stature and knowledge by being around and exposed to those level of people who have succeeded. I feel the same way about the people I've met in your program. Just the opportunity to be around people who are actually like-minded, aspiring to the same type of experience, and also the experts that you had at the New Media Summit, that helped me elevate. So there's a huge value in that, beyond the actual literal, so I think that can't be underestimated. Because just for my own personal growth and evolution in my own life, I had the Lone Ranger Syndrome, as Mary Morrissey would have called it years ago, where I thought I had to do everything alone and be the strong person that didn't need anybody. And I finally got to a point where it didn't work so well. Especially if you want to build a business.

Steve [23:20]

Yeah, you hit the ceiling of your own limitations. And that's part of where surrounding yourself with people who can help you not only see what you can't see and aren't able to see, but also in terms of just doing what it is that you want to do. And just simply by saying, "hey, look, if this is where you want to go, from experience, I can tell you that this is the right path to take. You're going to waste a lot of time and energy and effort over here, and resources, doing this and that can work, but that could take X amount of time, whereas if you really just focus here, it could get you to the same place and in a much more expedited period of time." So there's something to be said for simply having access to that knowledge. People talk about proximity is power. And that's really what you're investing in.

Cheryl Hodgson [24:21]

Absolutely, because there's two things there. One is the time factor, because I know in my younger years, I wasted a lot of time trying to do things by trial and error, and there was a lot of error. And I gained a lot of expertise, but it was the hard way. As opposed to doing it the smart way. So that's a huge factor. And I think there's been, one of the things that excites me personally about where we are in the growth and evolution of the information industry and everything from podcasting to trainings and online courses and the many talented people that are out there, is that it is becoming more useful. And not to keep harping on how wonderful your program is, but I think it's an important distinction that there are so many programs that I've taken in the past where, yeah, they were there, but there was nothing tactical about implementing it. As opposed to, "well, here's this knowledge, go figure it out on your own."

Steve Olsher [25:37]

There are a lot of people out there who have very good courses. And there are a lot of courses out there that are not very good, right? And so, I am always of the mindset that whatever I invest, I want to see a meaningful return on that investment. And I wouldn't ask any less for my clients. So yeah, that's a big part of it, is implementation. And at the end of the day, that's really how businesses won is through implementation. And in the training courses, and I think you're specifically talking about the Profiting from Podcasts training. It is all about implementation, and in this case, it's really how do you take full advantage of the medium of podcasting to generate high quality leads and turn those leads into conversations and turn those conversations into revenue?

Cheryl Hodgson [26:42]

So what is the next Evolution for Steve Olsher?

Steve Olsher [26:50]

So evidently, it's as the editor of a major magazine. That's where it gets really interesting here because literally in a very short period of time, it's given me... I didn't realize until we did this, the power of what a good media platform can do for someone. And podcasts can become a really good media platform. But I will tell you that I've been podcasting as I said, since 2009. On and off and then you know...

Cheryl Hodgson [27:34]

That was the Dark Ages, right?

Steve Olsher [27:38]

And we do okay with our shows, but it has never opened doors in the way that Podcast Magazine is. In a very short period of time. We're sitting down with, I've got face to face interviews with Dave Ramsey, with Jordan Belfort, with Adam Carolla, with Jenna Kutcher, and My Lets, and on and on and on. And this evolution is really, I believe, it's all led me to this place because, I am a good writer, I put a book as you said on the New York Times list, I wrote three books, I do a lot of webinars and other things, you know, whatnot. So this does combine a lot of the skill sets and it gives me the opportunity to put myself in the center of the conversation. And so that's where I want to be. When people think about podcasting, honestly, there's little reason why I should be a part of that conversation. I mean, the shows, as I said, are good, they're not going to show up in the top 10 of anything. The New Media Summit is great. It's a very boutique event, so it's never going to get to huge scale and the way that we do it because every It takes center stage to pitch. And so how do I...

Cheryl Hodgson [29:04]

That's an adventure by the way, I can attest to that. That's a growth experience.

Steve Olsher [29:09]

You get all those eyeballs on you and the spotlight and everything else. And you got two minutes to make it or break it, right?

Cheryl Hodgson [29:18]

But it's such a feeling of accomplishment to get through it.

Steve Olsher [29:21]

Yeah, you did great. You did great.

Cheryl Hodgson [29:23]

But it was a challenge. To step into that.

Steve Olsher [29:28]

And you got booked on all those shows, right?

Cheryl Hodgson [29:30]

Yeah. And you were, what was so great is, and I want to compliment you on that, I keep going back to it, but it was unique to anything I've ever experienced, was how you spent four weeks with coaching calls just to help us be prepared for what that experience was about and how to successfully navigate it.

Steve Olsher [29:51]

We tend to underplay the value of that. But yeah, it's one of the only events that I've ever been to, I can't even actually think of an event that I've been to, where the attendees have so much training before the actual event itself, that's just included. And so I hope you really get ready to take advantage of your time on stage and get that nailed. But again, just as far as this evolution goes, and whatnot, this feels pretty good. And it's scary at the same token, because we just finished the one publication and now, we're facing the deadline for the next one. And I'm not used to those sort of things.

Cheryl Hodgson [30:36]

Yeah, they come around rather quickly.

Steve Olsher [30:38]

There's a lot that goes hand in hand with that, but yeah, super excited to get Podcast Magazine going, and as I said, really just insert myself into the conversation because ideally, when people think of branding and trademarks and whatnot, you want them to think of Cheryl. And so when people think of podcasts, I want my name to at least be in that conversation. And this seems to be the most powerful way that I've come up with yet to really insert myself into that conversation.

Cheryl Hodgson [31:11]

Well, I think you've got the tiger by the tail. You also, by the way have published a podcast directory as well correct?

Steve Olsher [31:20]

So we do release something that is called the Ultimate Directory of Podcasters. And so if you're looking to familiarize yourself with shows, or if you want to be a guest on shows, in the directory, we have 670 leading podcasters broken down by category and the whole nine, everything is there, the name, show description, we even go so far as to give you the email address of either the producer or the host or someone that you can reach out to when you feel you're ready to potentially pitch them to be on their show. So we give away the Ultimate Directory of Podcasters and that's www.MyUltimateDirectory.com is where that is.

Cheryl Hodgson [32:04]

And we've talked a lot about starting a podcast and being a podcaster, but what advice would you have for someone who is wanting to be a guest on a podcast? What is the key to being one of those good special guests you talked about earlier?

Steve Olsher [32:22]

First and foremost, you have to be really familiar with the shows, in terms of take the time to listen to the shows. And don't just go out and randomly start firing off emails to shows that you've never even listened to. So you got to listen to the shows, find the shows that you really think you would be a good guest on, and why you would be a great guest on that show. And then articulate the value that you bring to the table. Because, like I said, even for Reinvention Radio, and Beyond 8 Figures, we get a lot of pitches. Every single week, "we want to be on the show." And ultimately, it really boils down to "what's the value that you add to the show?" insofar as the audience benefits, right? What's the audience really going to get out of your appearance? And so take the time to articulate three or four talking points in terms of what it is that you could focus on. And what the value add is for that audience. And of course, you want to articulate who you are and what you've done and why you are a credible expert to come onto the show. And if you can put all that on to what we call a media one sheet so you got one piece of paper that incorporates everything, even a few testimonials, if you have them, etc. Just makes them much easier for a producer or a host to make the decision about saying "yes, we'd love to have you on" And then of course, it's how do you pitch them by email, and templates, and all that fun stuff. And that's a whole other discussion.

Cheryl Hodgson [34:04]

That's a whole nother thing. Well, listen, I know you don't have a long time today because you have another engagement. And I'm so grateful that you showed up and you were here to support the cause, and to share your wealth of knowledge. But I have a couple of questions before we go. Is there something about you that somebody would be surprised to learn? That they wouldn't know?

Steve Olsher [34:29]

Maybe that I've been training in Brazilian Jiu Jitsu for roughly 20 years now. And about a stone's throw away from the black belt. So that'll happen this year in 2020.

Cheryl Hodgson [34:44]

Oh, congratulations. Are we going to celebrate?

Steve Olsher [34:46]

Well, I will when I get there, I've got to survive probably another 40 or so classes that are intense every single time so if I can survive those and get to black belt then awesome. So yeah, there's that. And I've been training off and on for about 20 years now.

Cheryl Hodgson [35:07]

Just a question. How does Brazilian jujitsu differ from jujitsu?

Steve Olsher [35:14]

It actually started out, the Japanese originally started this particular martial art and then the Brazilians adapted it. And it's the Gracie family out of Brazil. That really popularized what we know as jujitsu today. So it's their interpretation of the martial art that really has taken on a life of its own. And it seems like it's been forever but it's really only been about the last 20, 25 years or so that jujitsu has really come on to the map, if you will. Taekwondo, karate, kung Fu, all those have been around for a very long time, jujitsu has been around for a long time, but not in terms of its popularity.

Cheryl Hodgson [36:06]

Well, I guess that means that even now, it'd be a good idea to stay on your good side. And there's one final question I have, which is, if there was a couple of things that were either personal or professional on your bucket list, what would they be? What are they?

Steve Olsher [36:32]

That's a good question! There's definitely places that my wife and I want to travel to so I'd say it's probably just different locations, get out into some of the more... like, Thailands of the world and, Japan, we've never been over on that side. And even hell, we haven't even been to London, I think. Doing some of the European stuff and whatnot. So I think that travel is definitely one of the main things on the list and taking the kids, or just going solo with the wife. That's definitely on the agenda.

Cheryl Hodgson [37:15]

I was just having this conversation with someone recently that the international travel is not just about what you see and where you go, it's about experiencing other cultures and people to actually realize that we're pretty much all the same once you get beneath the surface. And that people mostly have the same desires and ambitions and hopes and fears, no matter what language in which they think or speak.

Steve Olsher [37:45]

And actually, interestingly enough, I still believe that a lot of what we do with our programs and teachings and so on, are very applicable for many, many, many different languages. So that's part of what I'm trying to figure out as well, is how to take some of the work that we've already done, and then get that put into those different languages. Because I agree with you, we're all very much the same, just happen to live in different places and speak different languages.

Cheryl Hodgson [38:21]

And the world of podcasting, there's nothing to stop it from going in many languages in many cultures. open market, see. So, do you have a gift you'd like to share with our audience? Is there something you could share with our audience to learn more about your...

Steve Olsher [38:42]

And again, I do think that the Ultimate Directory is probably a great place to start because there's about five pages before we actually start listing out the names of folks and give you some good insight in terms of how to get booked on shows and what to do and so on and so forth. We'd love to love to get folks the Ultimate Directory of Podcasters.

Cheryl Hodgson [39:01]

And do you have a URL for that? Or we can post it in the show notes?

Steve Olsher [39:05]

As I said earlier, it's just simply MyUltimateDirectory.com. And yeah, please feel free to post that in the show notes as well.

Cheryl Hodgson [39:13]

Awesome. Well, thank you so much, Steve Olsher. And I'd like to hope that you will come back soon and let us know about the great success of the Podcast Magazine

Steve Olsher [39:23]

Will do. And by the way, if people want to subscribe to that, they can get a free lifetime subscription at PodcastMagazine.com, so you can do that too.

Cheryl Hodgson [39:30]

Okay, everyone, make sure you subscribe and download the Ultimate Podcast Directory and we will see you next time.